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Keith
Aug 03, 2023
In Material Dating Methods
Among the general population, there are many misconceptions and assumptions made about radiometric dating methods used to arrive at the age of fossils and the supporting environmental materials in which they were buried. The most widely known method for dating organic material is, of course, or carbon-14, an unstable radioactive isotope of carbon. As we know, life on earth is carbon-based. When lifeforms die, the concentration of the stable isotopes of carbon (12C and 13C) remain constant while   begins to decay (becoming  14N/nitrogen-14) at a predictable rate until there is none left. The dating process makes assumptions amount of 14C  present when the animal or plant died and compares it to the amount of existing 14C  in the sample at the time of measurement. The rate of radioactive decay is measured in half-lives (1 half-life = 5730 years) and the concentrations of 14C, 13C and 12C are usually measured today using an Accelerator Mass Spectrometer (AMS). After 10 to 12 half-lives, for most samples, 14C levels will have fallen below the limit of detection of the AMS.  This is why specimens, believed to be more than 70,000 years old, are not normally subjected to 14C dating. That brings us to an area needing further exploration, analysis and review which is the anomaly that dinosaur soft tissue from deep time, that has undergone radiometric testing, repeatedly returns positive results for the presence of 14C when the overwhelming expectation is for a negative result. What is/are the likely reason/s for this? There are now more than 120 papers in peer-reviewed journal articles reporting soft tissues in dinosaur and other deep-time organic remains. These scientific papers describe biological material, including tissue and DNA, remaining inside fossils. A full list, which is being continually updated, is provided here: *List of Biomaterial Fossil Papers Example papers for this topic: (67) Type 1 Collagen in Cretaceous mosasaur humerus 2011 *This list of biomaterial papers can provide useful information for research and posting on topics within the Dinosaur Project Community. Thanks to researchgate.net for making this list freely available.
Carbon Dating Overview content media
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Keith
Jul 28, 2023
In Historical Evidence
With an impressive collection of cave art (drawings & paintings), pictographs, stone sculptures (petroglyphs), carvings and a library of dinosaur-looking ‘historical’ accounts of great beasts, often referred to as ‘dragons’, it is understandable for one to ask the question, “Were dinosaurs alive in a more recent time, coexisting with humans?” Regarding drawings, pictographs and petroglyphs of easily identifiable dinosaurs, it is easy to simply dismiss them as fakes, created in more modern times but this is not a scientific approach, if it is not accompanied by corroborating historical and forensic evidence. As an example, the controversial Acámbaro collection contains approximately 33,000 small ceramic and stone figurines allegedly unearthed by Waldemar Julsrud in July 1944, in the Mexican city of Acámbaro, Guanajuato. Identified by some as dinosaurs and therefore anachronisms, the claim was investigated and radiometric dated by Isotopes Incorporated of New Jersey, giving ages of the samples dating between 4530 BCE and 1110 BCE. In addition, samples were subjected to thermoluminescent testing by the University of Pennsylvania, giving dates of approximately 2500 BC, however, the results were later withdrawn when the U of P discovered that the samples were from dinosaur figurines. These appear to be figurines of dinosaurs. This appears to be a ancient human riding a Triceratops. Cambodian temple stegosaurus carving thought to be over 800 years old. Here are two (of many) historical accounts: Lucius Cassius Dio  (c. 165 – c. 235), a Roman historian and senator was one of several Roman writers who recorded the account of Roman general Marcus Attilius Regulus’ encounter with a dragon during the 3rd Century BCE. He wrote: “A dragon suddenly crept up and setted behind the wall of the Roman army. The Romans killed it and sent the hide to the Roman Senate. When the dragon was measured by order of the Senate, it happened to be 120 feet long and the thickness was fitting to the length.” Even Marco Polo, famed 13th century explorer, wrote about them during his time in the Far East: “In this province (Carajan) are found snakes and great serpents of such vast size as to strike fear into those who see them … Some of them are ten paces in length … The bigger ones are about ten palms in girth. They have two forelegs near the head but for foot nothing but a claw … The head is very big and the eyes are bigger than a great loaf of bread. The mouth is large enough to swallow a man whole and is garnished with great [pointed] teeth.” Dracorex Skull Dracorex - a pachycephalosaur / dragon?
Can History Through Art & Literature Tell Us Anything About Dinosaurs?  content media
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Keith
Jul 28, 2023
In Comparative Non-Dino Finds
Soft tissue discovered in dinosaurs undoubtedly kick-started the quest for more and more samples and data largely due to their size and popularity. I mean, who wouldn’t want to find their very own T-Rex tooth, triceratops horn or a velociraptor claw? However, there are plenty of ‘less glamorous’ deep time and non-deep time remains in collections, storage or still buried in the ground. From giant kangaroos (procoptodon goliah), mastodons and other megafauna to pterosaurs, turtles, plesiosaurs and flora, there are opportunities to further investigate soft tissue presence and the decay processes of other species, even if they are not considered to be ‘deep time’ fossils. There are now more than 120 papers in peer-reviewed journal articles reporting soft tissues in dinosaur and other deep-time organic remains. These scientific papers describe biological material, including tissue and DNA, remaining inside fossils. A full list, which is being continually updated, is provided here: *List of Biomaterial Fossil Papers Example papers for this topic: (122) Turtle blood vessels and osteocytes 2022 (118) Mongolemys osteocytes, blood vessels 2020 (113) Permian marker plant's lignin biopolymers 2019 (99) Bird preening (sebaceous) gland still containing oil 2017 (84) A pterosaur's orange claw material 2015 (67) Type 1 Collagen in Cretaceous mosasaur humerus 2011  *This list of biomaterial papers can provide useful information for research and posting on topics within the Dinosaur Project Community. Thanks to researchgate.net for making this list freely available.
It's Not Just Dinosaurs found with Soft Tissue content media
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Keith
Jul 27, 2023
In New Discoveries
With an estimated 25,000 recovered dino fossils (currently) from approximately 8,000 sites globally, dinosaur hunting has become a lucrative business for many which explains why so many of these deep time remains are not checked for soft tissue materials. The more complete the fossils are, the bigger the pay-cheque. A recent T-Rex skeleton was sold to a collector for $6.2m (US) in April 2023 while another was sold for a staggering $31.8m in 2020. At the other end of the scale, even a single skull, a femur or a collection of ribs can still amount to a reasonable income so hunters and collectors alike are not likely to want parts of their precious finds/purchases dissolved away. Tyrrell Field Station in Dinosaur Provincial Park with plenty of dinosaur bones. This is why it is so important to have any new fossil that has undergone decalcification, and showing soft tissue matter, brought to our attention along with new discoveries in the laboratory that contribute to the growing evidence by scientific analysis. For examples of New Discoveries, see our News page and additions to peer-reviewed journal articles. There are now more than 120 papers in peer-reviewed journal articles reporting soft tissues in dinosaur and other deep-time organic remains. These scientific papers describe biological material, including tissue and DNA, remaining inside fossils. A full list, which is being continually updated, is provided here: *List of Biomaterial Fossil Papers(http://tinyurl.com/4htm54w9) *This list of biomaterial papers can provide useful information for research and posting on topics within the Dinosaur Project Community. Thanks to researchgate.net (http://researchgate.net)for making this list freely available.
Big Bucks in Skull-duggery Means Less Soft Tissue content media
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Keith
Jul 27, 2023
In Crosslinking & metal oxidation
In 1992, when Mary Schweitzer discovered soft tissue in a T-Rex, she was subsequently presented with the problem of contradicting the deep time fossil model to which she was continually reminded by her sceptical peers. As such, she began the laborious but commendable tasks of confirming her discovery and searching for evidence that would both explain why this T-Rex soft tissue was present while keeping the generally accepted model intact. Mary Schweitzer in the lab Mary Schweitzer with Jack Horner After further research, she came to the conclusion, “...that under certain conditions organic substances, such as remains of blood, bone cells and claws, may persist in fossils for millions of years.”  She claims that the iron in the blood was capable of protecting amino acids, proteins, cells and other molecular structures against degradation to the significant preservation of organic matter. This has since been compared to a ‘fixative formaldehyde effect’. As explained, there is a crosslinking between iron (from hemoglobin/haemoglobin) and oxygen (oxidisation) creates this fixative environment. “Scientists do not understand exactly what sometimes allows organic substances to persist for tens of millions of years, but they have identified factors... that may aid the preservation and recovery of these materials.”  (Blood from Stone: MH Schweitzer 2010) Far from a slam dunk, game over, break out the champagne celebration, there are many sceptics shouting, “Foul!”, pronouncing that the real science hasn’t been done on this, that there isn’t anywhere enough ‘naturally occurring’ iron present to affect this kind of preservation over many millions of years. What does the evidence say? Are deep-timers onto a solution here or are they only demonstrating desperation in defending an untenable position? What do you say? There are now more than 120 papers in peer-reviewed journal articles reporting soft tissues in dinosaur and other deep-time organic remains. These scientific papers describe biological material, including tissue and DNA, remaining inside fossils. A full list, which is being continually updated, is provided here: *List of Biomaterial Fossil Papers(http://tinyurl.com/4htm54w9) Example papers for this topic: (47) Soft tissue and cellular preservation in vertebrate skeletal elements from the Cretaceous 2007 (100) Sea turtle muscle protein, beta-keratin, pigment 2017 (115) Triceratops blood clots, veins, valves, nerve fibers 2020 An additional paper currently missing from the Biomaterial Fossil List: A role for iron and oxygen chemistry in preserving soft tissues, cells and molecules from deep time 2014 https://doi.org/10.1098/rspb.2013.2741(https://doi.org/10.1098/rspb.2013.2741) *This list of biomaterial papers can provide useful information for research and posting on topics within the Dinosaur Project Community. Thanks to researchgate.net (http://researchgate.net)for making this list freely available.
Iron & Oxygen - Is this the Missing Link? content media
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Keith
Jul 27, 2023
In Blood Vessels & Hemoglobin
Blood vessels include a network of arteries, arterioles, capillaries, venules, and veins, carrying blood cells, water and chemicals throughout the body and can be referred to as organs. They are made from extracellular matrix proteins which form their basic structure. Haemoglobin (or Hemoglobin) in red blood cells is made up of two parts; haem/heme, which is an iron-containing compound responsible for oxygen binding in the lungs and globin, an iron-rich protein that carries oxygen throughout the body. Dinosaur soft tissue blood clots discovered from three geological periods. How are they preserved? Images provided courtesy of Mark Armitage A crucial question here is whether these dino circulatory components are found intact enough to represent the relatively short half-lives they are thought to have. One theory suggests components may have degraded to the point that their structures had become ‘unbound’ then rebinding into more stable matrices. There are now more than 120 papers in peer-reviewed journal articles reporting soft tissues in dinosaur and other deep-time organic remains. These scientific papers describe biological material, including tissue and DNA, remaining inside fossils. A full list, which is being continually updated, is provided here: *List of Biomaterial Fossil Papers(http://tinyurl.com/4htm54w9) Example papers for this topic: (25) Heme in Tyrannosaurus rex bone 1997 (112) T. rex cortical bone blood vessel structures 2019 (115) Triceratops blood clots, veins, valves, nerve fibers 2020  *This list of biomaterial papers can provide useful information for research and posting on topics within the Dinosaur Project Community. Thanks to researchgate.net (http://researchgate.net)for making this list freely available.
Bloodwork - Making Sense of the Evidence content media
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Keith
Jul 26, 2023
In General Discussion
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Keith
Jul 26, 2023
In General Discussion
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Keith
Jul 26, 2023
In General Discussion
Share your thoughts. Feel free to add images, hashtags and more to your posts and comments. Get started by commenting below. Palaeontologists carefully revealing dinosaur remains Please view this as an opportunity for discussion on all topics related to dinosaur soft tissue discovery, organic remains, testing and the impact they may have on how science views (or should view) the geological and historical timeline of planet Earth and its inhabitants. To post anything in The Community, you will need to become a site member or, as we prefer to call it, Community Member. Just click on the Login button at the top-right for desktop and top of menu for mobile, chose the Sign up with Email button (or other preference) and follow the prompts to create your new free membership. It can take up to a few days to get approval but normally it is quicker. We ask you to please be patient while The Community initially establishes itself and while new members join in. There are only a few rules we ask all members to abide by. Considering that the topic of finding organic material in dinosaur fossils remains controversial within a highly contested, geo-political climate, we request that community members treat one anther with the highest respect particularly where disagreements on matters such as education, discovery, published results, etc. are likely to occur. Of course your posts should not contain sales promotions, offensive language or Community posts will be moderated and any infringements on policy will be dealt with in a timely manner. We encourage you to share your knowledge, ask questions, participate in the discussions and become an integral part of this community. YOU are important because, without you, there would be no community. • Please note that if you cannot find a suitable/relevant category for your post, contact us to request a new category for review. • Images must not exceed 1000x1000 resolution or 2.5MB. There are now more than 120 papers in peer-reviewed journal articles reporting soft tissues in dinosaur and other deep-time organic remains. These scientific papers* describe biological material, including tissue and DNA, remaining inside fossils. To download a copy, click on the file-download below (open document spreadsheet) or get the latest version, which is being continually updated, here: List of Biomaterial Fossil Papers (http://tinyurl.com/4htm54w9) *This list of biomaterial papers can provide useful information for research and posting on topics within the Dinosaur Project Community. Thanks to researchgate.net (http://researchgate.net)for making this list freely available. (Last udated June 26, 2023)
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